Stephanie and I have a friend who is really into Star Wars. He is convinced that everything in it is possible once we have the science for it. I call this the science of the gaps. Atheists complain about attributing the things I don’t understand to the gods. They are right to a point but if they place science in the gaps they are making the exact same categorical mistake. The assumption that the universe is completely knowable if we put our favorite idol as a placeholder until we know is very likely false. There will always be things we don’t know and are probably things that we can’t ever know. Using science as a placeholder until we do is just as dangerous as using God.
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Latter Day Sinner 
19 responses to “Those Gaps”
“The assumption that the universe is completely knowable if we put our favorite idol as a placeholder until we know is very likely false. There will always be things we don’t know and are probably things that we can’t ever know. Using science as a placeholder until we do is just as dangerous as using God.”
support your assertion. Why do you think this?
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Do you agree that the god of the gaps is wishful thinking? I understand why it is. I just don’t see much difference between that and science of the gaps. It leads people to confirmation bias. If a man sees evidence of God everywhere he looks he shuts himself out to actual inquiry. You know this. With science it’s a little different. The inquiry is there but the desire to find the supporting evidence sometimes at great cost to understanding reality is also there. The example that I use is the assumption that the fossil record will eventually prove Darwin correct about gradual evolution. The record that we have has long stretches of species appearing and disappearing suddenly. But the science of the gaps insists that the evidence will eventually be found. At some point that becomes willful ignorance and that is never good. When people persist in willful ignorance it is as I said dangerous.
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No evidence of any gods so yep, it’s wishful thinking that they would ever be an answer. We know that science works. Prayer, wishes, etc do not.
So science has a chance to figure things out. Your god will never be the right answer.
Every cultist sees their god everywhere and they all use much the same arguments for their gods but won’t accept those arguments from anyone but those they agree with already.
Unsurprisngly, science is built to negate confirmation bias, unlike religion.
the fossil record has already proven Darwin correct and that evolutoin happens. The record we have is far better than you claim. We fill in more and more gaps in the record, and yet theists keep lying that we have nothing. That is willful ignorance in a nutshell.
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Yes, we’ve established that you think I am a liar and a fraud and that is the only thing a theist can be. Unless you have something interesting to say you can go away since you have never been interested in productive dialogue.
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Yep, until you can show your god exists, I do think that, especially when you directly lie about evolutoinary theory. Nice of you to admit you have nothing. It’s notable how christians findn they must lie and try to blame the questioner when they have no answers.
Do you think your god won’t notice?
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I’ve given you the evidence that convinces me. It doesn’t convince you. One of us is wrong. You are coming to me to complain. I can’t help you any further. Take your sense of superiority to someone who cares about you.
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so? every theist does that and every theist rejects similar claims to theirs if their god isn’t involved. That’s why you need facts, not baseless assertions.
You can’t go any further since you have nothing, just like those theists you claim are wrong.
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The only theists I reject are Trinitarians. I have carefully and meticulously considered that god and rejected it. With every other god I give people the benefit of the doubt. I’m an agnostic theist and a monoltrist. So if you have facts give them to me without the condescension. As they said in the old cop show, “Just the facts, Ma’am.”
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So you accept Hinduism? Shinto? Zoroasterianism? “God” is the christian deity and I see you are LDS aka mormon, but like all theists you have invented your own version.
your own words seem to not support your claims of agnostic theism:
“I have been a member of the LDS Church for over twenty five years but still don’t feel I am worthy to be called a Saint. This is a page about my day to day life seeking sanctification and solace.
I am called by the Holy Spirit:
“Walk upright but be humble”
“Listen well and remind people of their dignity.”
“Know your worth and teach them theirs.”
“Reach up to God and He will reach down to you.”
“It is time to rest and let the divine carry you.”
“Know your place in the world and accept its gifts.”
“The natural man must die for the spiritual man to live.””
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I have studied Hinduism extensively and find much wisdom in it. Shintoism teaches about kami which is a fascinating and valuable framework. I don’t know much about Zoroastrianism. Most of that is from non primary sources like Baha’i writings and Neitzche.
I have been accused of being a “Cafeteria Mormon.” Taking a little of each spiritual food without committing to any. I question whether that is sanctification or sin and as you just read that mostly why I blog at all.
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ah, so you do just make up your own religion. AGain, nothing new, all theists do that in my experience.
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Everyone sees the world in their own image. Our experiences make us who we are and each individual perceives each thing in the world differently. I admit that is the case with me but I know for a fact it is the case with you as well. Atheism and theism have very little to do with that aspect of human nature.
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that’s true but when you claim to have the only truth it doesn’t work out very well.
atheism is simply concluding that something without evidence doesn’t exist. that works with human nature quite well.
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When have I claimed to have the only truth? I certainly don’t. I BELIEVE there is ultimate truth, but that we can only dimly perceive it. Science helps discover evidence that allows to move in the direction of that truth. Science is preliminary. My faith tends to be. If you present me with evidence that Krishna was not a god, then perhaps I will change my mind. But it can’t be the usual begging the question by starting with the premise there are no gods so Krishna isn’t a god. That isn’t evidence.
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are these truths or not:
“I am called by the Holy Spirit:
“Walk upright but be humble”
“Listen well and remind people of their dignity.”
“Know your worth and teach them theirs.”
“Reach up to God and He will reach down to you.”
“It is time to rest and let the divine carry you.”
“Know your place in the world and accept its gifts.”
“The natural man must die for the spiritual man to live.””
If you claim the holy spirit is the truth, then krishna can’t be the truth. They are mutually exclusive by the claims of the religion.
There are no gods, until you can produce one.
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They are not mutually exclusive and I have already given you the reasons that I believe that the divine exists. Just because you don’t like my reasons to believe doesn’t mean they aren’t reasons.
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Yes, you claim the “divine” exists, but you pick and choose from many religoins that contradict each other. Your reasons are no different from any other theist’s, and since theists are always sure each other are wrong, that’s why I question reasons that you yourselves question.
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As I have said I don’t claim to have a perfect knowledge of the divine. I think the experiences of others is valuable even if I disagree with them. You are a case in point. I kind of feel sorry for you that you have never experienced the divine yourself.
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No need to feel sorry for me not experiencing something that doesn’t happen. I can feel awe, wonder, etc. I don’t attribute that to magic. In that no one can show that the divine exists, claims of experience of it should be met with skepticism, since each claims something different as a supposed “truth”.
if you disagree with someone, that means you are claiming they are wrong and that they are excluded from what you claim is right. This is where I find the mutual exclusivity.
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